trouble scoring the LZ-DX contest

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trouble scoring the LZ-DX contest

Joop Stakenborg-4
First of all, thanks for the new release! I have started using tlf a few
weeks ago, very happy!


I am having trouble scoring the lz-dx contest. Points are okay, but
multipliers not. The multiplier is either the ITU zone or the LZ
district. So I would like to have something like ITU_&_SECTIONS, which
would work the same as DX_&_SECTIONS.


Here is part of my rules file, which does not work properly (lz_dx_mults
attached):


#################################
#  CONTEST PARAMETERS
#################################
#
MULT_LIST=lz_dx_mults
COUNTRYLIST=LZ
SECTION_MULT
ITUMULT
#
#################################
#  POINTS LIST
#################################
#
COUNTRY_LIST_POINTS=10
MY_CONTINENT_POINTS=1
DX_POINTS=3




lz_dx_mults (114 bytes) Download Attachment
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Re: trouble scoring the LZ-DX contest

Thomas Beierlein-4
Hi Joop,


Am Sun, 17 Nov 2019 10:30:22 +0100
schrieb Joop Stakenborg <[hidden email]>:

> First of all, thanks for the new release! I have started using tlf a
> few weeks ago, very happy!
>
Nice to hear.
>
> I am having trouble scoring the lz-dx contest. Points are okay, but
> multipliers not. The multiplier is either the ITU zone or the LZ
> district. So I would like to have something like ITU_&_SECTIONS,
> which would work the same as DX_&_SECTIONS.
>
Sigh, it is a trouble with those 'creative' contest designers (Rant
off).

You are right, at the moment there is no solution for your problem.
Scoring your contest results will be correct, as it is done by the
contest organizer. But we would want at least a good guess how we are
doing.

The keyword suggested by you (ITU_&_SECTIONS, or better
ZONE_&_SECTIONS) would work (and could be added in the next version of
TLF).

But I fear there will be another combination of multipliers
poping up soon which we do not have in our repertoire.
So a better solution is needed - same goes for point scoring.

I did some investigation how other contest programs solve these problem.
One of the ideas there are to classify multipliers into some main
categories:

- Country/DXCC
- Zone CQ or ITU
- Prefix
- section or similar

With that we could allow more to count more than one category as multi
and would need additional rules how to combine the values (add if more
than one or score only one) and how to count on different
bands (BY-BAND or ONCE). Than your ITU_&_SECTION could be something
like:

COUNTRY_MULT = DXCC,BY_BAND
ZONE_MULT = ITU,BY_BAND ADD

I am not sure if that would catch all or at least most of the multi
scoring problems for existing contests.

Feedback on that is very much welcome.

73, de Tom DL1JBE

>
> Here is part of my rules file, which does not work properly
> (lz_dx_mults attached):
>
>
> #################################
> #  CONTEST PARAMETERS
> #################################
> #
> MULT_LIST=lz_dx_mults
> COUNTRYLIST=LZ
> SECTION_MULT
> ITUMULT
> #
> #################################
> #  POINTS LIST
> #################################
> #
> COUNTRY_LIST_POINTS=10
> MY_CONTINENT_POINTS=1
> DX_POINTS=3
>
>
>



--
"Do what is needful!"
Ursula LeGuin: Earthsea
--


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Re: trouble scoring the LZ-DX contest

jim smith
Thomas,

Just throwing out an idea here, would it be possible to have one
keyword (say CUSTOM) for the rules file, and for that particular
contest the user could build their own multiplier file?  Might be
tedious once, but might provide an interim work-around until something
more sophisticated could be implemented.

--
73, Jim N0OCT


On Sun, 17 Nov 2019 18:19:14 +0100
Thomas Beierlein <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Joop,
>
>
> Am Sun, 17 Nov 2019 10:30:22 +0100
> schrieb Joop Stakenborg <[hidden email]>:
>
> > First of all, thanks for the new release! I have started using tlf a
> > few weeks ago, very happy!
> >  
> Nice to hear.
> >
> > I am having trouble scoring the lz-dx contest. Points are okay, but
> > multipliers not. The multiplier is either the ITU zone or the LZ
> > district. So I would like to have something like ITU_&_SECTIONS,
> > which would work the same as DX_&_SECTIONS.
> >  
> Sigh, it is a trouble with those 'creative' contest designers (Rant
> off).
>
> You are right, at the moment there is no solution for your problem.
> Scoring your contest results will be correct, as it is done by the
> contest organizer. But we would want at least a good guess how we are
> doing.
>
> The keyword suggested by you (ITU_&_SECTIONS, or better
> ZONE_&_SECTIONS) would work (and could be added in the next version of
> TLF).
>
> But I fear there will be another combination of multipliers
> poping up soon which we do not have in our repertoire.
> So a better solution is needed - same goes for point scoring.
>
> I did some investigation how other contest programs solve these
> problem. One of the ideas there are to classify multipliers into some
> main categories:
>
> - Country/DXCC
> - Zone CQ or ITU
> - Prefix
> - section or similar
>
> With that we could allow more to count more than one category as multi
> and would need additional rules how to combine the values (add if more
> than one or score only one) and how to count on different
> bands (BY-BAND or ONCE). Than your ITU_&_SECTION could be something
> like:
>
> COUNTRY_MULT = DXCC,BY_BAND
> ZONE_MULT = ITU,BY_BAND ADD
>
> I am not sure if that would catch all or at least most of the multi
> scoring problems for existing contests.
>
> Feedback on that is very much welcome.
>
> 73, de Tom DL1JBE
>
> >
> > Here is part of my rules file, which does not work properly
> > (lz_dx_mults attached):
> >
> >
> > #################################
> > #  CONTEST PARAMETERS
> > #################################
> > #
> > MULT_LIST=lz_dx_mults
> > COUNTRYLIST=LZ
> > SECTION_MULT
> > ITUMULT
> > #
> > #################################
> > #  POINTS LIST
> > #################################
> > #
> > COUNTRY_LIST_POINTS=10
> > MY_CONTINENT_POINTS=1
> > DX_POINTS=3
> >
> >
> >  
>
>
>


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Re: trouble scoring the LZ-DX contest

Joop Stakenborg-4
In reply to this post by Thomas Beierlein-4

Op 17-11-19 om 18:19 schreef Thomas Beierlein:

>
> But I fear there will be another combination of multipliers
> poping up soon which we do not have in our repertoire.
> So a better solution is needed - same goes for point scoring.
>
> I did some investigation how other contest programs solve these problem.
> One of the ideas there are to classify multipliers into some main
> categories:
>
> - Country/DXCC
> - Zone CQ or ITU
> - Prefix
> - section or similar


Some contests, like cwops and FOC ones, have the callsign as a
multiplier, crazy if you ask me!

But tlf can handle this with UNIQUE_CALL_MULTI=ALL, no problem!


> With that we could allow more to count more than one category as multi
> and would need additional rules how to combine the values (add if more
> than one or score only one) and how to count on different
> bands (BY-BAND or ONCE). Than your ITU_&_SECTION could be something
> like:
>
> COUNTRY_MULT = DXCC,BY_BAND
> ZONE_MULT = ITU,BY_BAND ADD
>
> I am not sure if that would catch all or at least most of the multi
> scoring problems for existing contests.


I agree, we need a more flexible way of scoring. Right now it is quite a
study to setup a contest with all the different keywords that tlf uses
in the rules file. I am willing to do as much testing as you like.


> Feedback on that is very much welcome.
>
> 73, de Tom DL1JBE
>
Thanks Tom!

73 Joop PG4I


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Re: trouble scoring the LZ-DX contest

jim smith-3
In reply to this post by Thomas Beierlein-4
Thomas,

Just throwing out an idea here, would it be possible to have one
keyword (say CUSTOM) for the rules file, and for that particular
contest the user could build their own multiplier file?  Might be
tedious once, but might provide an interim work-around until something
more sophisticated could be implemented.

--
73, Jim N0OCT

On Sun, 17 Nov 2019 18:19:14 +0100
Thomas Beierlein <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Joop,
>
>
> Am Sun, 17 Nov 2019 10:30:22 +0100
> schrieb Joop Stakenborg <[hidden email]>:
>
> > First of all, thanks for the new release! I have started using tlf a
> > few weeks ago, very happy!
> >  
> Nice to hear.
> >
> > I am having trouble scoring the lz-dx contest. Points are okay, but
> > multipliers not. The multiplier is either the ITU zone or the LZ
> > district. So I would like to have something like ITU_&_SECTIONS,
> > which would work the same as DX_&_SECTIONS.
> >  
> Sigh, it is a trouble with those 'creative' contest designers (Rant
> off).
>
> You are right, at the moment there is no solution for your problem.
> Scoring your contest results will be correct, as it is done by the
> contest organizer. But we would want at least a good guess how we are
> doing.
>
> The keyword suggested by you (ITU_&_SECTIONS, or better
> ZONE_&_SECTIONS) would work (and could be added in the next version of
> TLF).
>
> But I fear there will be another combination of multipliers
> poping up soon which we do not have in our repertoire.
> So a better solution is needed - same goes for point scoring.
>
> I did some investigation how other contest programs solve these
> problem. One of the ideas there are to classify multipliers into some
> main categories:
>
> - Country/DXCC
> - Zone CQ or ITU
> - Prefix
> - section or similar
>
> With that we could allow more to count more than one category as multi
> and would need additional rules how to combine the values (add if more
> than one or score only one) and how to count on different
> bands (BY-BAND or ONCE). Than your ITU_&_SECTION could be something
> like:
>
> COUNTRY_MULT = DXCC,BY_BAND
> ZONE_MULT = ITU,BY_BAND ADD
>
> I am not sure if that would catch all or at least most of the multi
> scoring problems for existing contests.
>
> Feedback on that is very much welcome.
>
> 73, de Tom DL1JBE
>
> >
> > Here is part of my rules file, which does not work properly
> > (lz_dx_mults attached):
> >
> >
> > #################################
> > #  CONTEST PARAMETERS
> > #################################
> > #
> > MULT_LIST=lz_dx_mults
> > COUNTRYLIST=LZ
> > SECTION_MULT
> > ITUMULT
> > #
> > #################################
> > #  POINTS LIST
> > #################################
> > #
> > COUNTRY_LIST_POINTS=10
> > MY_CONTINENT_POINTS=1
> > DX_POINTS=3
> >
> >
> >  
>
>
>